'Eddington' (2025) Interview: Joaquin Phoenix

Moviefone speaks with Joaquin Phoenix about 'Eddington' and working with director Ari Aster. "I love Ari's observations and the way that he writes."

Joaquin Phoenix in 'Eddington'. Photo: A24.

Opening in theaters on July 18th is the critically acclaimed new film from director Ari Aster (‘Beau Is Afraid’ and ‘Midsommar’) called ‘Eddington’.

The movie stars Joaquin Phoenix (‘Joker’), Pedro Pascal (‘The Fantastic Four: First Steps’), Emma Stone (‘Poor Things’), Austin Butler (‘Elvis’), Luke Grimes (‘Yellowstone’), Michael Ward (‘The Old Guard’), and Clifton Collins Jr. (‘Star Trek’).

Moviefone recently had the pleasure of speaking with Oscar-winner Joaquin Phoenix, along with other select members of the press, in an online roundtable interview. Phoenix discussed his work on ‘Eddington’, creating his character, the rehearsal process, working with the cast including Pedro Pascal and Emma Stone, reuniting with his ‘Beau Is Afraid’ director Ari Aster, and continuing to collaborate with the acclaimed filmmaker moving forward.

Related Article: TV Review: ‘Joker: Folie à Deux’

Joaquin Phoenix in 'Eddington'. Photo: A24.

Joaquin, can you talk about collaborating with director Ari Aster and the costume department to create the look for your character, Joe Cross, and did you take any inspiration from fictional or historical figures?

Joaquin Phoenix: Early on when Ari was still working through the script, we took a trip together to New Mexico, where he introduced me to a few different sheriffs and mayors in some small towns and pueblos, that he had met on a previous trip. There was one man in particular who just looked amazing. I loved how he looked, and he was wearing the white shirt, jeans and boots. I took some pictures of him and then I didn't really plan on using it, he was just one of several people that I met. Then I went to Mexico to start prepping and worked with Anna (Terrazas) and she had some sketches of the traditional sheriff's uniform, the brown uniform, and then also the look of the photos that we'd center on this sheriff, which was the jeans and white shirt. Ari and I both felt like the brown uniform was right. So, we went there, and I put that on and then at the end of the fitting, I said, "Do you have any of the white shirts and jeans? Like that other look? So, she pulled it out. Then for the next two weeks, all through rehearsal leading up to literally the day before shooting, me and Ari went back-and-forth over which look was right. A couple days before we started shooting, we did the camera test and just before that camera test, I pulled up a picture I had of the sheriff, and he had these glasses on. I just said, “Do you have any glasses like this?” We put these glasses on during the camera test and we all just went, “Oh, that's it. There it is”. It was strange how they all came together, but really it was a kind of a last-minute decision and there were times throughout shooting where I wondered whether we made the right choice, but it came alive.

The relationship between your character and Pedro Pascal’s character is really the engine that drives the movie, but you don’t have a lot of screen time together. Can you talk about how you and Pedro approached those scenes to create the depth and energy needed to move the story forward?

JP: Well, they're all great scenes that are just full of conflict, rumor, hurt feelings and insecurity. It's like everything that you would want, all the ingredients are there. I think there's four major scenes with us, maybe. I always felt like I was the beneficiary of the environment or the production design that fuels us. So, one of the early scenes of the movie where I'm talking to him at his bar, and we're separated by glass. For some reason, when I read the script, I didn't register that. When I got there that day, it was separated and I go, “Wait, what are we doing? It was literally this like, block. It was a blockage to connecting with him. It seemed like this perfect kind of metaphor that there's just something that is between us that's separating us from connecting. Then the scene after I announced that I'm running for Mayor, there was this crazy storm in New Mexico, it was literally sunny and by the fourth take the wind was whipping through and it ultimately ended up hailing. So, I think part of it is like, you're just trying to be receptive to what is happening and whether that's an energy on set or what the other actor is doing or something that's happening in the environment. I just I felt like I had an amazing partner in Pedro, who seemed very clear on who Ted was, particularly I’m thinking about the scene in the supermarket just before I announced that I'm running for mayor. I was not sure of what I was doing at that point. It was early in the shoot, and I didn't fully understand where I was. I was trying to figure out, like, “Wait, but who am I? What do I do I stand for? What's important to me?” Of course, in hindsight, I realize that's exactly what Joe was experiencing. Ted is somebody who thinks that he's doing exactly what he's meant to be doing. So, what we were feeling was really kind of matching what was happening. But Pedro, he knew what he wanted, he was so gracious in allowing me to find it, because let me tell you, I was like all over the map. What you're seeing in that scene is I guess subconsciously, I really worked myself up to into a state of frustration, anger and impotence. For me, I remember that take and there was a take where I acknowledged that people might be filming in the supermarket and it was the first time that that happened, you know, in that take. It just it felt alive, so I had somebody that I was working with that was able to allow that to happen.

(L to R) Joaquin Phoenix and Pedro Pascal in 'Eddington'. Photo: A24.

What did you discover about the character while you were filming that was surprising to you and different than what you initially thought about the character when you first read the screenplay?

JP: Well, it was surprising. I knew my intention was to humanize Joe as much as possible. I hoped that anybody that came in that might have some preconceived idea of who a conservative sheriff in a small town might be, I wanted to challenge those ideas, at least initially. So that was a goal of mine. I have to say that I ended up feeling a great deal of warmth for Joe. I don't really know how to explain it. I think a certain kind of sadness and, no spoilers, but for him to allow all that dissatisfaction and frustration and pain to manifest in the way that it does, it's just disappointing. I think maybe he reminds me of so many people in the real world, in those kinds of critical moments that we all face and like, what kind of person are we going to be? So, I think I was initially surprised at how much I cared for him, and then how much his actions disappointed me.

Moviefone: Joaquin, can you talk about your working relationship with director Ari Aster, how that has grown and changed since making ‘Beau Is Afraid,’ and what it was like collaborating with him again on ‘Eddington’?

JP: I think that we were less cordial, thank God. There's something, also, when I look back on some of our conversations, it really seems like a family. I was excited by that. I mean, even on ‘Beau’ he was very perceptive, but at this point now, he's armed fully with information about how I work. He sees things before I'm even aware of them. So, that was great. We had talked. We had started working together and reading through the script a year in advance. So, we'd been through so many discussions about how Joe was going to talk because the very first thing for me when I was reading this script, I just heard this voice. Then we got together, and I was like, “I heard this voice.” He was like, “Well, what is it?” I was like, “I don't know. I don't know how to do it. I don't know how to physically bring it out. I don't know exactly what it is, but I just heard it in my head.” So, we just kept talking and occasionally I would try things and we spoke to this dialect coach and we're like, “We're not meeting with a dialect coach. What are we doing?” I just really liked trying to figure out who is, but I remember this one moment on set. It was our first official day of shooting, and it was the news conference. I was really struggling. I was nervous, and I felt like there was something missing from the scene. I couldn't identify what it was exactly. I just knew that it had to do with acknowledging, it's right after I make the announcement to be mayor, and I needed to acknowledge it somehow. I remember it was super uncomfortable because we were running out of time, and we had to go to lunch. We'd already burnt like an hour. We didn't have anything yet. So, I was nervous. Then I'm standing in front of the chalkboard and I'm practicing my lines, and Ari’s standing next to me, and he's going through the lines at the same time. We're both standing side by side and Ari takes on the feelings, like he's doesn't separate from the character. So. he's doing it and I just feel him and there's a point where he just made this gesture. Where he put up his hands like, “I'm sorry”, as he was talking. I just was like, “Oh, that gesture, that's it. That's Joe.” Joe's always in the state putting up his hand trying to stop the world, trying to stop the thing that's happening. Like, everything is falling. He's losing grasp of his relationship, and this idea of himself and what it is to be a man, and to be an American and to be a man of power. It's all slipping away from him, and he's just constantly trying to put up his hands, going, "No, stop. It's going to be okay.” It was this moment that just unlocked it for me, at least for that scene. It gave me some clarity and that's just a strong memory that I have.

(L to R) Micheal Ward, Joaquin Phoenix and Luke Grimes in 'Eddington'. Photo: A24.

Joaquin, this is only your second film with Ari, but already some critics are comparing your work together to that of actor and director pairings like Martin Scorsese and Robert De Niro or Spike Lee and Denzel Washington. How do you feel about those comparisons, and is Ari a filmmaker that you see yourself continuing to collaborate with throughout your career?

JP: Well, that is so flattering, but I will not say that we are in the same classes. I'll speak for myself, I don't feel like I sit shoulder to shoulder with those guys, but that's very nice to hear that. I would hope so. I just adore Ari. I love his observations, human behavior, the way that he writes, and just how much he really cares about making films. It's pure. You know, I've worked with like a lot of directors and there's so many different reasons why people do what they do. But there's something very pure and innocent about Ari's love for film and for filmmaking. It's inspiring and to be honest, at my age after I've made so many movies, there is a point, it’s just human where you can grow bored or complacent. Sometimes you don't have that same natural fuel that you do when you're 20 years old and you're trying to make it, and you're just like so full of drive and ambition. To work with somebody like Ari, where that is still so alive in him, and he sees it in you, that is a gift. So, I love working with him, and I consider him a friend, and yeah, I would absolutely do anything with Ari again, for sure.

Finally, you had an extensive rehearsal period before you began shooting the film. What was that process like for you and did rehearsing with Emma Stone, Luke Grimes and Michael Ward help you find the character?

JP: Yeah, it felt like it was like all these different stages. So initially, I think for the first week of filming, it was just the interior Sheriff’s office, and it was me, Luke and Michael. So, I was able to really focus on and establish that relationship and we're doing that in real time. We had some rehearsal days, but it's very hard to rehearse. The set isn't completely done, you don't have all the props around. I mean, you're standing in your own clothes. It's difficult for me to rehearse like that. So, it's just about having conversations. Then I went from that to, I believe, Pedro came to town and then that was working with Pedro for a week or so and I was exploring that part of the story. Prior to that, I was just in this mode where I was like, “The whole movie is just me in a sheriff's station with my two deputies.” That's what it felt like. Then, there's this whole other part of the story and so they went into Pedro's part where so much of what's at the heart of our relationship and dynamic is Emma's character. But I haven't yet seen Emma and worked with her on this film and so there's things that I'm discovering about her character, my feelings about her character, through scenes with Pedro before Emma even arrives. It sounds confusing and it is at times, but also sometimes is informative. It's interesting how film schedules work out. Sometimes it's really to your benefit. By the time Emma came, I think she came on the third week, and I said, “I feel like I've been shooting for three months already.” It felt so loaded and full of this history, which felt crucial with her relationship because we're obviously the people that have the greatest history and the one whose relationship is most troubled from the get-go. So, I was really kind of thankful for how things worked out because I think she arrived, and it was already fraught in in the best possible way.

Editorial Note: Don Kaye took part in the roundtable and contributed to this article.

Eddington

"Hindsight is 2020."

R2 hr 29 minJul 18th, 2025

Showtimes & Tickets

In May of 2020, a standoff between a small-town sheriff and mayor sparks a powder keg as neighbor is pitted against neighbor in Eddington, New Mexico. Read the Plot

What is the plot of ‘Eddington’?

In May 2020, a standoff between a small-town sheriff (Joaquin Phoenix) and mayor (Pedro Pascal) sparks a powder keg as neighbor is pitted against neighbor in Eddington, New Mexico.